The world’s premier network for those seeking to share and discuss high-impact,high results, super practical information for the developmentof superiorphysical performance.
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 12
  1. #1
    Rambodoc is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Kolkata, India
    Posts
    1,134
    Blog Entries
    20

    Default How Hard Is Hard Training?

    Footballers get hospitalised because of hard workouts. A few months back, there was another controversy that we also discussed re creatine use, a related issue.
    And here I am, just using KBs as a recreational strength tool, stopping at the first sign of distress. The progress I have made is not bad, personally speaking.
    No comparisons, of course, but do you believe in hard training? Why, or why not?
    BMI--Fat Loss For Life
    Practising moves (for self-learning) on You Tube: www.youtube.com/thekbdoc

    There is an RKC in every surgeon (like me, as a random example).

  2. #2
    DTris is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Dayton, OH
    Posts
    856

    Default

    I remember when I was a child training for a martial art tournament. During class we would do pushups and situps and a few other things. The volume changed so smoothly that none of us noticed that after 10 weeks we went from doing maybe 50 pushups a night to literally a couple hundred. Never got sore, never got hurt, only had fun got stronger and better.

    As an adult I have done the smoking myself and getting so sore I can walk and doing such hard leg workouts I can't walk up stairs. I am getting away from that. I am really trying to take to heart "Finish your workout feeling as if you could conquer a kingdom".

  3. #3
    EricJMoss is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Morris County
    Posts
    1,166

    Default

    i do believe in hard workouts some of the time. one of the things that was holding me back in viking warrior conditioning was calling it quits before i really should have. part of it is knowing how to push through when you need to.

    having said that most of the time my training sessions are hard enough but not too hard. if you are injuring yourself it is too hard. progress is the name of the game and if you are ending up in the hospital you won't do much progress there
    Eric Moss RKC, FMS
    Only weirdos neglect to read my blog EricJMoss.com you aren't a weirdo are you?
    The secrets of the closed door RKC forum finally revealed here

    Kettlebell Bootcamp Class in NJ

    Disclaimer: I am not responsible for the words that come out of my mouth or the ones I type and nothing I recommend should be taken as medical advice or even anything intelligent.


  4. #4
    Rambodoc is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Kolkata, India
    Posts
    1,134
    Blog Entries
    20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EricJMoss View Post
    i do believe in hard workouts some of the time. one of the things that was holding me back in viking warrior conditioning was calling it quits before i really should have. part of it is knowing how to push through when you need to.

    having said that most of the time my training sessions are hard enough but not too hard. if you are injuring yourself it is too hard. progress is the name of the game and if you are ending up in the hospital you won't do much progress there
    I understand and appreciate. Sometimes, perhaps, you know you tried too hard only when you picked up an injury.
    BMI--Fat Loss For Life
    Practising moves (for self-learning) on You Tube: www.youtube.com/thekbdoc

    There is an RKC in every surgeon (like me, as a random example).

  5. #5
    JSStevensRKC is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    320
    Blog Entries
    3

    Default When is Hard Training Appropriate?

    "Hard Training" needs to be defined first. It can mean many different things to different people. For me it means breaking past your perceived limitations.

    If recovering from a workout derails your training, it's too hard.
    If it does not derail your training, it's probably just right.

    Whatever hard training is I believe it is most appropriate under the guidance of an experienced and responsible mentor/coach. Someone that has your best interests in mind, recognizes you have more potential than the level your are performing at and knows how to get you to perform at a higher level without unnecessary risk.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I recall some great quotes related to this topic from a podcast with Dan John (I'm paraphrasing)
    - If you can look in the mirror and talk to your friends while lifting, it's not heavy enough.
    - If you don't blow a blood vessel in your eye once a year or so while benching, it's not heavy enough.
    - You know you are doing a heavy squat when your spotters are afraid.
    - You know you're doing a heavy deadlift when you pull for about 10 seconds and THEN the weight starts to come up off the floor.
    Last edited by JSStevensRKC; 01-27-2011 at 08:16 AM. Reason: additional text added & re-wrote 1 sentence.

  6. #6
    Jason M is offline Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    26

    Default

    Jim Wendler said something along the lines of: It's not cardio unless afterwards you think to yourself 'God, that was awful....'

  7. #7
    faizalenu is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    4,931
    Blog Entries
    309

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rambodoc View Post
    Footballers get hospitalised because of hard workouts. A few months back, there was another controversy that we also discussed re creatine use, a related issue.
    And here I am, just using KBs as a recreational strength tool, stopping at the first sign of distress. The progress I have made is not bad, personally speaking.
    No comparisons, of course, but do you believe in hard training? Why, or why not?
    There is hard, and there is stupid. This is stupid.

    If the training makes you better, than hard training is OK. If it puts you in the hospital it is not, and the buffer zone is between effective and stupid is pretty wide with a lot of warning signs. There were A LOT of warning signs in this case.
    Faizal S. Enu, CFT/RKC/PBA
    My blog: http://faizalenu.blogspot.com
    Workshop Schedule: http://tinyurl.com/XA-Kettlebell-Workshops

  8. #8
    mcneuen is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    462

    Default

    I think there is more to the story than we can know at this time. They were doing a program that they've done in past years, and all 5 of the program's s&c coaches were on hand. Different seniorities, different workout groups and different field positions. Chris Doyle came up under Mike Boyle and isn't generally viewed as irresponsible. To have 13 kids have rhabdo all at once on a supervised program that hasn't caused any problems in the past says to me that we don't know all of the facts yet. Like maybe the kids were taking some unauthorized ephedra or other supplements. A cluster this big under a legitimate coach is just too unusual.
    -Laura McNally, RKC
    Twitter: @ChgoKettlebell

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    58

    Default

    I don't see a reason for hard training, just goal oriented training.

    For strength or power one only needs to do the bare minimum to get results, progressing in weights or to harder variations with perfect technique is all that matters. Surviving more time under extreme load is a catastrophic risk to reward scenario - why do more than you have to, especially if it is dangerous? If "bare minimum" was merely followed from the beginning, the risk to reward ratio would stay favorable the whole time. Sometimes you do have to make things harder, but you should be minimalist with that too. It's like petting a cat, take it easy or you're going to get bit.

    All that matters is the goal.

    For cardio, fatloss, or gaining muscle you have to have enough challenge to reach your goals. It may be necessary to condense your rests or volume and get out of your comfort zone but you never have to harm yourself. Results come on gradually and you don't get more from more necessarily. Huge recovery times are a setback, over-training a waste.

    Intangibles such as mental toughness are best sorted out by specialists or by doing things that more closely resemble the task you are preparing for.
    Last edited by Timothy Spencer; 01-27-2011 at 02:08 PM.

  10. #10
    mcneuen is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    462

    Default How Hard Is Hard Training?

    Following up on the article above, if you want a flavor for Chris Boyle, the strength and conditioning coach at Iowa, take a listen to ep. 16 of the Strength Coach Podcast.
    -Laura McNally, RKC
    Twitter: @ChgoKettlebell

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Free Course
Close