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  1. #1
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Default L, Y, T, P (or W) shoulder rehab question

    I live quite remote from any sort of athletic trainer, several hours each way over snow and ice covered roads so I am hoping for any suggestions here.

    Got biceps tendonitis almost a year ago. Had to completely stop doing anything overhead and couldn't do much of anything except body weight squats for quite awhile as the pain was quite intense with any movement of arm. Got diagnosed by a great Naturopath in Tucson (Garrett Smith, N.D.) and he prescribed the LYTP set, 50-100 reps every other day or even daily with 10-15 lbs max and lots of ice. (Issue was overdeveloped internal rotation and underdeveloped external rotation of humerous--40 years paddling surfboard did that!) Did LYTP for months and recovery plateaued. Then I discovered that if I pushed it a little (feet elevated push-ups, etc), I would get a lot of pain the next day but the day after it would be improved from before pushing it. So I figured I was breaking up adhesions etc from 4 or 5 months of inflammation. Went with that for awhile and it was about 95-98% healed (like that precision?) so started doing a few snatches and TGU's. No issues so went to PM w/ 16 kg and started working into TGU's w/ 24 kg. No problem until I went from bridge to kneeling w/ the 24 and I had to drop it due to sudden flash of burning pain right in the old deltoid. Same old. Pretty aggravated for a week or so but now improved enough for swings, planks, bridges, working on pistols. If I try to do pull-ups, packing shoulders lights it up. I can do horiz pull-ups no problemo. So finally, I get around to the questions:

    1) Would there be benefit to increasing weight on the L, Y, T, P's?

    2) Just very recently noticed doing the L, Y, T, P's that the side with the problem has nervous system resistance to contracting the lats and rhomboids and whatever else is in there for shoulder packing. That is a more specific and new diagnosis of the original problem or maybe a deeper issue showing up. I think it is left over from shoulder injury about 35 years ago. Any clues to "waking up" those muscles? So far I am just really focusing on cinching them up, making sure that side shoulder is packed, when I do anything at all with my arms...

    Thanks for taking the time to read and ponder this!

  2. #2
    Steve W. is offline Senior Member
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    Default

    I can't really give you any specific medical or rehab advice.

    However, having been through a shoulder surgery and physical therapy, 10-15lbs and 50-100 reps several times a week, or even daily, strikes me as much too much weight, volume and frequency for these exercises.

    I do these prone on the floor, which forces you to be very strict and not use any momentum. I usually don't use ANY added weight, and have never gone over 5lbs. I do them in a circuit of 5 reps per exercise and never do more than 3 circuits. And I never do this more than 3x/week.

    Just sharing my experience -- good luck.
    In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.

    Just because it happened to you doesn't make it interesting.

  3. #3
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Thanks Steve. Don't know what to make of that. I have been kneeling on Pilates reformer, hard to know for sure as resistance increases as springs stretch, but somewhere between 20 and 30 lbs split between both hands. Yesterday did 3 sets; 25 reps, 20 reps, 15 reps. Lately been hitting it 4 days/week.

    Original goal was to retrain/rebalance shoulder posture both at rest and under load.

  4. #4
    powerlifter54 is offline Senior Member
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    Geoff,

    This is a great shoulder rehab/prehab movement. i do them with a light to medium band, with the band under my feet, laying on my back on the floor, with my feet elevated. The drill did much less for me until i did it this way. Good luck.

    Also, high rep Kb rows. Keep that elbbow tucked into side and pull elbow behind torso. Reps are 15+ a set.
    jmo
    PL54 RKC

  5. #5
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    This is a great shoulder rehab/prehab movement.
    What are you referring to here? The parts of the LYTP's?
    KB rows... hmmmm... good idea! Mañana.

  6. #6
    md corral is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeoffreyLevens View Post
    ...he prescribed the LYTP set, 50-100 reps every other day or even daily with 10-15 lbs max...
    Hi Geoffery- I'm interested in understanding how this is going for you/ what you are dealing with. Unfortunately, I have some experience with bad shoulder problems. I did some google searching on the LYTP drills but am not sure I've got the right stuff.

    Do you know of a video or blog post out there that shows something close to what you are doing? Can you point me to it?

    Thanks!
    CC1 & 2 Progress- Pushups 4, Leg Raises 7, Pullups 3, Squats 7, Bridges 4, Twists 3

  7. #7
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Here is site Dr Garrett sent me to for detail

    http://nicktumminello.com/2009/07/a-...improved-ytwl/

    Seems to be a lot of new info and tips so next stop for me is reading that in detail

    Paddling surfboard superficially looks like a pulling action but the loaded portion of the stroke is really all internal rotation. I did that for many hours/week for probably 40 years. (More fun than anything else I have ever done. Ever!). So net result was/is very slight internal rotation of humerus as my muscular and neurological set point. Net result if burning pain when I load biceps w/ arm anywhere overhead. Pain is pretty focal, in the groove between the anterior and medial deltoids. It does radiate if I piss it off but I try to avoid that! Occasionally I have felt the biceps tendon ka-thunk in/out of it's little trough.

    Floor press is ok, TGU roll-up to elbow is fine, to post and bridge are ok as well. I was ok w/ 16 kg for sets of 5 full TGU's but as soon as i went to kneeling w/ the 24, instant pain. So I just dropped the weight (glad the cat was nowhere near by!).

  8. #8
    md corral is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeoffreyLevens View Post
    Here is site Dr Garrett sent me to for detail

    http://nicktumminello.com/2009/07/a-...improved-ytwl/

    ...Occasionally I have felt the biceps tendon ka-thunk in/out of it's little trough...
    Thanks Geoffery for the link. I had found that one. There is quite a bit there. I'm interested in checking it out.

    Just a thought...Mark Rif has been dealing with issues with his shoulder and bicep tendon. He's got some interesting thoughts on his blog. See the blog for 12/17/2011. He's working with jump stretch bands and doing something to reset the shoulder. Might be interesting to take a look at.

    http://rifsblog.blogspot.com/

    I did some shoulder joint distractions myself and got a nasty surprise. My surgically repaired shoulder did not like stretching and creating space in the joint. There was some pain several hours later and it's stalled my training by a few days as I recover.
    CC1 & 2 Progress- Pushups 4, Leg Raises 7, Pullups 3, Squats 7, Bridges 4, Twists 3

  9. #9
    md corral is offline Senior Member
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    Hey Geoffery- Take a look at this vid. I think it answers some of your questions: Keep it "pretty light", 2 or 3 times per week, 8-15 reps per letter.

    And take a look at the 3rd sequence for a more challenging progression.

    http://nicktumminello.com/2010/05/ly...ways-to-do-it/

    Thanks for pointing this stuff out. I'm looking for drills that work for me for posture correction (rounded shoulder, internally rotated, head forward from too much time on computers).
    CC1 & 2 Progress- Pushups 4, Leg Raises 7, Pullups 3, Squats 7, Bridges 4, Twists 3

  10. #10
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Thanks for those links MD. I have been doing the LYTP kneeling on pilates reformer. I think I am pretty good about not using lumbar except to brace but taking it all the way out of the equation like in that 3rd sequence seems like a great idea. Next session I'm doing that!

    I don't feel like humeral head is out of alignment but I will try that distraction thing because why not? Might be surprised, hopefully in a good way.

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