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  1. #31
    kodo kb is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ad5ly View Post
    The OP's question is about "maintaining athleticism and health in the long run". Not about what you like better. BW trng lends itself to keeping ones body fat at minimum and having the joints of the body able to move through its entire range of motion while strengthening and keeping the connective tissues of the joints healthy. Also far less injuries while having balance in all aspects of strength training. But nothing can beat an oly-bar as a tool for getting supa strong in the big lifts as a goal. But BW trng has the benifit of getting you strong and healthy through the entire spectrum of strength - minimum BF, flexibility, balance, body awareness, mental toughness, max strength over your lifetime with few injuries..Dennis
    Dennis, I like your other point better... the one about picking goals first, then use the various tools to strive towards that goal. I don't think there is anything inherently more damaging about the methods or weight-lifting or bw or kb training. And I'd argue body awareness just comes with consciously using one's body in various ways.

    Also, I hope by bw training people are only referring to what Paul Wade calls strength-calisthenics. You can't exclude basic mobility or flexibility work, walking, running, sprinting, hiking, swimming, jumping, etc. just because one usually only uses their bw during those activities; we live the majority of our lives in bw-only mode. I mean, it's definitely not weight-training, but you can't just label those methods solely under bw training. If that's the case, you have picked a winner before you even start the question.

    In the opposite direction, I don't think anyone here think bw-only trainers shirk away from tasks such as moving, where all you do is pick things up, carry them, put them down, and repeat a hundred or so times. They're plenty coordinated to work with the rest of the world because, well, they live here too.

    I never got the arguments about what training methods leads itself better to real life. Training for health purposes is pretty much GPP stuff, plus whatever rehab stuff you need to do if something (not so) funny happens along the way. All training modalities offer great GPP benefits; I'd say their slight differences only matter when discussing SPP benefits. (And most of these are efficiency questions, like how barbells are easier to program an armor building program with, how kb swings can help teach a new athlete full hip extension, or how bridge work easily adds the flexibility needed by wrestlers into the strength program).

    Train however you like to train, in a manner that fits your goals, and make sure to make progress patiently. Also, move your body in all the ways you want it to be efficient in moving. Do these things, and I think you'll be as athletic as you want for as long as you'd like. (Well, at least your 70s or something.)

    My $.02,
    Josh
    Last edited by kodo kb; 08-06-2012 at 11:23 PM.
    "I can't imagine how it WON'T work...save you not doing it." — Dan John

    "I never went to the gym to "work out". Rather I went to LEARN. The workout was incidental." — Dr. Ed Thomas

  2. #32
    Spikeman1444 is offline Senior Member
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    Great way to put it Josh! I say train in whichever way you enjoy. If you don't enjoy it you won't keep it up for long. I was referring to strength-calisthenics.

  3. #33
    BillLumbergRKC is offline Senior Member
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    this thread makes me really want Chad Waterbury's new book to come out. In fact, it seems his philosophies are more in line with dragondoor than tnation...

  4. #34
    kodo kb is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillLumbergRKC View Post
    this thread makes me really want Chad Waterbury's new book to come out. In fact, it seems his philosophies are more in line with dragondoor than tnation...
    My google-fu has failed me. I could only find this, http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...=643686&page=1, a list of his articles where he talks about his methodology. Sounds a bit more like Gym Movement stuff than Hardstyle--with his emphasis on lots of volume, variations of exercises, and quicker lifting (he is writing to a hypertrophy audience though, so that could explain the differences)--but those two methods do overlap a good amount (at least how I read the two).
    What's the main topic of the book, or where could I find out more about it?

    Josh
    Last edited by kodo kb; 08-07-2012 at 10:09 AM.
    "I can't imagine how it WON'T work...save you not doing it." — Dan John

    "I never went to the gym to "work out". Rather I went to LEARN. The workout was incidental." — Dr. Ed Thomas

  5. #35
    BillLumbergRKC is offline Senior Member
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    the best way to get the gist of C.W.' s philosophy would be to read the article, "Anti-Bodybuilding Hypertrophy Program." His new book that isn't out yet, but is based on this idea: he observed cirque de soleil acrobats training daily and sporting top notch physiques. Then check out the calves and tear drop on a soccer player. How bout the forearms of a mechanic (at least the ones that don't have powered everything) Conclusion: frequency is your friend, but how do you take advantage of this?

  6. #36
    kodo kb is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillLumbergRKC View Post
    the best way to get the gist of C.W.' s philosophy would be to read the article, "Anti-Bodybuilding Hypertrophy Program." His new book that isn't out yet, but is based on this idea: he observed cirque de soleil acrobats training daily and sporting top notch physiques. Then check out the calves and tear drop on a soccer player. How bout the forearms of a mechanic (at least the ones that don't have powered everything) Conclusion: frequency is your friend, but how do you take advantage of this?
    Yea... I read that one. Actually the one that most reminded me of some of the practices of Gym Movement (but now that I think about it more and read the specific routine instead of just the philosophy, the implementation isn't all that similar.) Seems like solid training, and I've been a little more interested in volume work over the past few weeks. Thanks for the heads-up about the book, I'll have to keep my eyes open for when it comes out.

    Josh
    "I can't imagine how it WON'T work...save you not doing it." — Dan John

    "I never went to the gym to "work out". Rather I went to LEARN. The workout was incidental." — Dr. Ed Thomas

  7. #37
    BillLumbergRKC is offline Senior Member
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    i'm a volume fan myself. typical example from my training log:

    8/3
    1)gymnastics bridge x 109
    2)Lhold x 33 sec
    3) pullups x 100
    4)pistol x 102
    5)dbl steep incline (hatfield press) 50's x 20
    6)HSPU x 34
    a)uneven PU x 46
    b)incline board press x 36
    c)stretch flys 15's x 30

    As you can see, i rarely write down sets, but only total reps - that's how much I'm fired up about volume training.


    keep a journal and let's write a book in a year or so!

  8. #38
    RJ79 is offline Senior Member
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    Waterbury didn't "invent" 10x3 but I like it

  9. #39
    Chris Hansen is offline Senior Member
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    The funny thing about bodyweight exercises is you can have a fully equipped "bodyweight" gym packed with: Climbing ropes, pullup bars, glute-ham raise bench, stall bars, rings, paralletts, dip bars, and more. There might not be a weight plate in the house and technically it would be "bodyweight training" but certainly not equipment free.

  10. #40
    Spikeman1444 is offline Senior Member
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    I believe for full body weight fitness all you need is something to hang from. even a tree branch.

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