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  1. #1
    ilidek is offline Junior Member
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    Sep 2017
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    Default Low Back Pain After ABS exercise from Convict Conditioning

    Hello,

    BACKGROUND: [If needed / helpfull in answering my question]
    I gave myself a test and gave up gym weight exercises for half year and was doing only what Paul Wade Recomended in his Convict Conditioning. I stayed with his exercises since end of Jan 2017.

    After reading CC2 and briefly CC3 I understood that my slow pace of doing exercises is the right way for joint health, etc. I am doing stuff slowly and give my best to do it the right technique.

    QUESTION:
    After doing ABS exercise from CC level 3 I have low back pain, the very next day after exercises. I saw very different approaches over the internet so I decided that I am going to write here with hope someone will replay with some tips what to try.

    [MORE BACKGROUND INFO]
    1) I had those low back pains, 5 weeks ago. I decided that even though I am at level 3 of ABS I am going to start BRIDGE faster because my back can be weak. Was doing BRIDGE for 5 following weaks and skipped ABS completely up to yesterdady. Yesterday did ONLY 7 ABS Level 3 exercsies one set and back pain came back.
    2) In the meantime I was doing three stretches from him, bridge as stretch, L-Stand ABS (level 1), side stretch 3-4 times a week.
    3) When I was doing weight training I was doing deadlift with like 130kg, 2x8 full pull ups on rings, squads with 90-110kg, etc.
    4) Going through first level of his ABS took me from Jan to Apr, I had super hard time doing his 'easy' ABS since day 1 and it took me a lot of effort to go through it. Level 2 took me from Apr to end of May and since May I am fighting with level 3.



    I hate every single one of ABS exercises. I do like working out, was going at the gym for 4 years, was doing some matrial arts, I love almost every form of exercsies except those ABS... It tells me one thing, I hate it because something is wrong with my performance and it's easier to hate than fix issue. Went to physicotherapist and she told me that probably my hips weren't active and other muscles was doing it's job. But still progress is super slow, even back are level 4 now, when ABS is level 3.

    I would guess that some musscless are very weak or I have some sort of thigtness somewhere and it slows down every single exercise and it's mostly visible at ABS. If you have any recomendations I am willing to try it out.

    Thanks for help,
    Regards, Pawel

  2. #2
    NSmetzer is offline Senior Member
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    Aug 2013
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    Wooster, Ohio
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    Default

    Okay, so assuming you're at level 3 in the Abs, you have fully completed levels 1 and 2? I personally find that level 1 is very tough to progress from, I have not gotten past that level. I do, however, also add in the bridges. My suggestion would be to maybe go back to level 1 and work that again to higher repetitions, as those seem to really hit the hip flexors.

  3. #3
    chixlegs is offline Member
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    Aug 2013
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    Default

    Here are some exercises you can do that does not involve the lower back or the hip flexors
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIhCuqtC0r0

    You can change the exercises to suit your bad back. Instead of
    step 3: instead of lying Bent Leg raise, do Side Plank Leg Lifts instead
    step 4: instead of Frog Raise, do Alternate Leg Raise instead. Like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05sG32Mrsqw but with the raised leg straight.
    step 5: instead of lying Straight Leg Raise, do Gymnast Abs instead
    You can then continue to
    step 6: hanging knee raise


    Also, do you have Anterior Pelvic Tilt? If you lie down, feet flat on the floor, knees bent at around a 45 degree angle, and your lower back arches, then you probably have APT. Your bad back may be caused or made worse by the APT.
    Last edited by chixlegs; 09-21-2017 at 10:55 AM. Reason: added another youtuve video

  4. #4
    MostlyFull is offline Senior Member
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    Apr 2014
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    Default

    Try putting your hands under your buttocks and raise your head so your chin touches your chest. This slightly rounds the back and takes it out of the exercise, places emphasis on the abs where it belongs. If you have your head on the floor and back arched you will feel a lot of discomfort in the lower back.

    i know what the YouTube vids show, those guys can do step ten and then some. Their core is strong enough that they can do step 3 however they want.

  5. #5
    chixlegs is offline Member
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    Aug 2013
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    Here’s an interesting video that says you _should_ arch your back!?!?!?

    https://youtu.be/BWxds-qDg7Q

    Any truth/good idea to this view?

  6. #6
    MostlyFull is offline Senior Member
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    Apr 2014
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    Once again. When your core is strong enough, you can do this exercise any way you want.

  7. #7
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Sep 2010
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    Just found this. Gives excellent explanation with model for visuals and exercise demo

    Back Pain With Ab Exercises (WHAT TO DO)

  8. #8
    ilidek is offline Junior Member
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    Sep 2017
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    Default

    @NSmetzer
    "Okay, so assuming you're at level 3 in the Abs, you have fully completed levels 1 and 2?"
    I did.


    "I personally find that level 1 is very tough to progress from, I have not gotten past that level. I do, however, also add in the bridges. My suggestion would be to maybe go back to level 1 and work that again to higher repetitions, as those seem to really hit the hip flexors."
    Same here. It used to be hard as hell. Thanks but not thanks. I hated this exercsies with my whole heart. I had to put soo much efort to add 1-2 reps a week. This exercsise doesn't seem to fix any of those problems, saying that did what I had to do with it.






    @chixlegs
    If I understand you corectly, this is what you meant:
    [img]https://image.prntscr.com/image/MGKY...2K22cL6TGg.png[/img]
    and it rather shows that I don't have it


    Thanks for alternatives. Will try some tips from post bellows, maybe it will let me do those exercises, if not will try your alernatives. (Like arching my back and chin, I was doing it naturally but I was forcing myself to lie flat because I've thought it's cheating).






    @MostlyFull
    Thank you very much. Def I am going to try it. Nautally I was trying to do it your way but I've thought it's cheating.


    @GeoffreyLevens
    Hmmm and how would you use it in CC exercise?

  9. #9
    GeoffreyLevens is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilidek View Post
    @GeoffreyLevens
    Hmmm and how would you use it in CC exercise?
    I think most back pain from ab exercises is as stated in the video, from using hip flexors (esp psoas) to do the movement without firing the abs strongly enough to balance them. That causes the psoas to pull the spine out of alignment. So when doing CC ab exercise, any stage, focus more on moving the pubic bone as if trying to touch it to base of your sternum. Let the legs/hip flexors be secondary to that. Same principle as hollow body position where you press lumbar spine into the floor. These are all just cues to emphasize activating the abs as the primary movers with hip flexors working hard as well but in secondary capacity. Same mistake people make using ab roller i.e. allowing the hip flexors to do most of the work; with luck they can do many reps with minimal impact on abs, and with bad luck they will sprain their low back. Been there, done that (45+ years ago and still paying the price with injury prone low back). Most of what I am hoping to convey is mental focus while performing the exercise. Drive with a bit of a posterior pelvic tilt. Anterior tilt will kill your back.

  10. #10
    ilidek is offline Junior Member
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    Sep 2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeoffreyLevens View Post
    I think most back pain from ab exercises is as stated in the video, from using hip flexors (esp psoas) to do the movement without firing the abs strongly enough to balance them. That causes the psoas to pull the spine out of alignment. So when doing CC ab exercise, any stage, focus more on moving the pubic bone as if trying to touch it to base of your sternum. Let the legs/hip flexors be secondary to that. Same principle as hollow body position where you press lumbar spine into the floor. These are all just cues to emphasize activating the abs as the primary movers with hip flexors working hard as well but in secondary capacity. Same mistake people make using ab roller i.e. allowing the hip flexors to do most of the work; with luck they can do many reps with minimal impact on abs, and with bad luck they will sprain their low back. Been there, done that (45+ years ago and still paying the price with injury prone low back). Most of what I am hoping to convey is mental focus while performing the exercise. Drive with a bit of a posterior pelvic tilt. Anterior tilt will kill your back.
    Thank you very much. Will test how it works on my next exercise. For now it was real pain in the ass.
    From the photo: https://image.prntscr.com/image/MGKY...2K22cL6TGg.png It seems like I do or I don't have this posterior pelvic tilt?

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