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Thread: HCG Diet?

  1. #21
    contemporaryjkd is offline Junior Member
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    Default HCG Protocol

    This aint me or Trudeau saying it. this is backed by scientific research and doctors, after all this was created by a medical doctor so here are the Literary References to the use of Chorionic Gonadotrophin in Obesity:
    The Lancet
    Nov.6, 1954 Article Simeons
    Nov.15, 1958 Letter to Editor Simeons
    July29, 1961 Letter to Editor Lebon
    Dec.9, 1961 Letter to Editor Carne
    Dec.9, 1961 Letter to Editor Kalina
    Jan.6, 1962 Letter to Editor Simeons
    Nov.26, 1966 Letter to Editor Lebon

    The Journal Of The American Geriatric Society
    Jan. 1956 Article Simeons
    Oct. 1964 Article Harris & Warsaw
    Feb. 1966 Article Lebon

    The American Journal Of Clinical Nutrition
    Sept.-Oct. 1959 Article Sohar
    March 1963 Article Craig,et al.
    Sept. 1963 Letter to Editor Simeons
    March 1964 Article Frank
    Sept. 1964 Letter to Editor Simeons
    Feb. 1965 Letter to Editor Hutton
    June 1969 Editorial Albrink
    June 1969 Special Article Gusman

    The Journal of Plastic Surgery(British)
    April 1962 Article Lebon

    The South African Medical Journal
    Feb. 1963 Article Politzner,Berson & Flaks

    Please Feel Free to research these, I also have 90 References
    Backing up what Im saying Just let me Know if you want those 2

  2. #22
    Semonides is offline Senior Member
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    hi jkd,

    All your references are 40 years old. If you want to persuade some of these doubters you will need some more recent evidence. Drive up to Irvine where their medical school library and the resources they have for their Nobel prize winning chemists and biologists will surely give you some updated authority.

  3. #23
    ninkageaikidoka is offline Senior Member
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    @Semonides, why do you need more recent evidence? Is there an expiration date on proof? I'm pretty sure Newton's laws still stand and they were proven hundreds of years ago, do you need studies from the last ten years to believe in them?
    Aaron Thornton, CPT and [URL="http://www.charlespoliquin.com/TheBiosignatureMethod.aspx"]BioSignature Practitioner[/URL]

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  4. #24
    fttfbass is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ninkageaikidoka View Post
    @Semonides, why do you need more recent evidence? Is there an expiration date on proof? I'm pretty sure Newton's laws still stand and they were proven hundreds of years ago, do you need studies from the last ten years to believe in them?
    "Facts" on fitness and nutrition are constantly changing on a daily basis. I think that would be a pretty reasonable request.
    Luke-ISSA CFT & IKFF CKT

  5. #25
    Semonides is offline Senior Member
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    in the 50's and 60's medical doctors were endorsing cigarette smoking and the surgeon general in his report said that smoking pipes and cigars were just as healthy as non-smoking. So, yes, I would require something more recent. Also, as a researcher by profession, I have to wonder why people still are not invoking and citing these studies. When I find righteous stuff from mid-century, it is accompanied by peer-reviewed evidence from its own time and continued peer-reviewed studies from our own. Therefore, I do not have a problem with old evidence...as long as it can, like Newton, stand the test of time.

  6. #26
    mc
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    Default the published poop of hcg

    A list of names with old dates without descriptions of what's being discussed in the articles doesn't really help unpack the resaerch - and nice one S. about doctors and ciggies in the 50's/60's

    so let's get up to date a bit more:

    Obes Rev. 2004 Nov;5(4):217-32.
    Evaluating commercial weight loss programmes: an evolution in outcomes research.

    Hamilton M, Greenway F.
    Pennington Biomedical Research Center, Baton Rouge, LA 70808, USA.
    The increasing prevalence of obesity has been mirrored by a parallel increase in the number of commercial weight loss programmes. Research evaluating these programmes is meagre, however, compared to the numbers treated. Reluctance of commercial weight loss programmes to meaningfully evaluate their weight loss efficacy may arise from fear that competitors will use the results against them. Evaluation of commercial weight loss programmes usually progresses from testimonials, often by famous people who were successful, to uncontrolled studies of past participants evaluated either by the programme itself or by an outside entity. The gold standard, however, is a scientifically rigorous, controlled study of the programme conducted by an independent entity. Such a study, published in a peer-reviewed journal, can gain credibility for a programme, as it did with Slim Fast, if the results are positive, or herald the end of the programme, as it was with Simeons human chorionic gonadotropin injection clinics. This review of the evolution of the evaluation process of commercial weight loss programmes leads us to conclude that consumers are likely to demand greater scientific rigour in the future, a change that will favour informed choice and discourage the practice of unrealistic advertising that raises false hopes.
    or not

    indeed the authors further note

    The Simeons treatment consisted of daily injections of human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) in conjunction with a 500 kcal-diet. A 6-week study comparing injections of HCG to injections of saline showed no difference in weight loss between the treated and control groups, both of which had been placed on the same 500 kcal-diet (14). Similar findings by others foretold the end of HCG as a scientifically accepted adjunct to diet in the treatment of obesity. The above study tersely dismissed HCG as a viable treatment for obesity: Therefore, we feel that the 20 year-history of the use of HCG in the treatment of obesity should come to an end because injections of placebo appear to be equally effective in all respects.

    Here are the key studies to which this 2004 report refers.
    This was the beginning of the end of this program - that first double blind study i was asking about

    Am J Clin Nutr. 1976 Sep;29(9):940-8.
    Ineffectiveness of human chorionic gonadotropin in weight reduction: a double-blind study.

    Stein MR, Julis RE, Peck CC, Hinshaw W, Sawicki JE, Deller JJ Jr.
    Our investigation was designed to retest the hypothesis of the efficacy of human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) on weight reduction in obese women in a clinic setting. We sought to duplicate the Asher-Harper study (1973) which had found that the combination of 500 cal diet and HCG had a statistically significant benefit over the diet and placebo combination as evidenced by greater weight loss and decrease in hunger. Fifty-one women between the ages of 18 and 60 participated in our 32-day prospective, randomized, double-blind comparison of HCG versus placebo. Each patient was given the same diet (the one prescribed in the Asher-Harper study), was weighed daily Monday through Saturday and was counselled by one of the investigators who administered the injections. Laboratory studies were performed at the time of initial physical examinations and at the end of the study. Twenty of 25 in the HCG and 21 of 26 patients in the placebo groups completed 28 injections. There was no statistically significant difference in the means of the two groups in number of injections received, weight loss, percent of weight loss, hip and waist circumference, weight loss per injections, or in hunger ratings. HCG does not appear to enhance the effectiveness of a rigidly imposed regimen for weight reduction.
    and the follow up:

    West J Med. 1977 Dec;127(6):461-3.
    Human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) in the treatment of obesity: a critical assessment of the Simeons method.

    Greenway FL, Bray GA.
    Injections of human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) have been claimed to aid in weight reduction by reducing hunger, and affecting mood as well as aiding in localized (spot) reduction. We have tested these claims in a double-blind randomized trial using injections of HCG or placebo. Weight loss was identical between the two groups, and there was no evidence for differential effects on hunger, mood or localized body measurements. Placebo injections, therefore, appear to be as effective as HCG in the treatment of obesity.
    The 2004 review doesn't cite anything more current that contradicts the above findings.

    So that's the barrier of entry: credible work since 2004 that shows a significantly different effect.

    just fyi.

    mc
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  7. #27
    mc
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    Default irony

    So i went to look at a couple of the papers if they're available cited above as support for hcg.

    here's an abstract from the AJCN, 1963 (abstract available)

    American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol 12, 230-234, Copyright © 1963 by The American Society for Clinical Nutrition, Inc.

    Chorionic Gonadotropin in the Treatment of Obese Women

    LEELA S. CRAIG M.D.1, RUTH E. RAY M.D.1, SAMUEL H. WAXLERM M.D.1, and HELEN MADIGAN B.S.1 1 From the Department of Medicine and the Nutrition Clinic, University of California School of Medicine, San Francisco, California


    No effect of chorionic gonadotropin therapy in producing weight loss was found in a study on a group of twenty obese clinic patients. The women were treated for a forty-day period with a 550 calorie diet and a daily injection of either chorionic gonadotropin or a placebo solution, administered by the double-blind technic. All but one subject lost weight, but the losses were small and not uniform, suggesting varied adherence to the diet. The basal metabolic rate was increased in four treated patients and two control subjects. These changes could not be correlated with weight loss, apparent adherence to diet or protein-bound iodine levels.
    oh, and here's the one cited in 195x by Sohar:
    We assumed from the start that the success
    of Simeon’s’ regimen was in no way related to
    gonadotropin. This was clearly borne out by
    the results of the present series in which
    patients receiving 125 units of Antuitrin S
    showed the same dairy weight loss as those
    patients receiving 125 units of Antuitrin Ssaline.
    So i dunno, but there may have been studies talking about hcg, but this list "created by a medical doctor so here are the Literary References to the use of Chorionic Gonadotrophin in Obesity" (from what source? what doctor?) seems to have put together some rather damning findings.



    But also it seems that from pretty much day one, the claims about hcg have been held to be pretty dubious stone soup'in where only simeons seems to be saying "it works" Indeed, his letter in the lancet (not an article) in 1962 asserts that people without hcg have to be extra disciplined for VLC to work, but those on HCG don't.

    It's amazing to think that in each of the double blind studies, the randomized assignment of participants to groups just happened to get all the disciplined people in the placebo group so they'd have the same outcomes as the hcg group.

    What's really intriguing is that the article it seems that started it all was a one page note in the lancet that ONLY tested an hcg population and was very specualtive - suggesting that HCG (naturally occuring) has a more significant role in the endocrin system, and that HCG is involved in the control of obesity.

    These hypotheses are speculative and worthy of further trialing. That without that trialing (like placebo'ing) someone founded a profit-making enterprise on such flimsy maybe'ing - when there are so many other variables having an effect - is remarkable.

    And that is seems any published double blind placebo shows hcg makes zip difference means that anyone making special claims for HCG is selling snake oil.

    As the early trial by Sohar suggested (and i said too before reading this) The Injection may have a profound psychological effect that makes the 500kcal a day more doable.


    mc
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  8. #28
    Theresa is offline Member
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    Ok, and update:

    did some research and it looks like this is legit. My concern was causing muscle tissue loss and subsequent rebound fat gain after ending the diet. But it looks like most people keep the fat off for quite a while, probably longer if they do not go back to eating crap.

    Also, it can be done without animal products-as a vegan, that would be important to me.

    My friend who is using this is getting pretty amazing results. According to everything I've read and heard from others, there isn't a rebound weight gain after, esp. if one eats healthy.

    Also, since we store toxins in adipose tissue, it seems plausible that this could also have a detoxifying effect on the body-always a good thing.

    I don't have much fat to lose, but I'm so curious. My friend is using homeopathic HCG, which is taken orally, is WAY cheaper than injections and supposedly just as effective. Hmm....I'm getting curious....

  9. #29
    contemporaryjkd is offline Junior Member
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    Default Hcg

    Like I said in my last post, I got 90 more citings some more recent, but Im not going to sit here and type 90 listings. It worked for me and the tens of thousands of ppl around the world that have done it. There will always be skeptics and people trying to discredit this protocol. I say why not just do it? The only thing youll loose is weight, youll sleep better, high blood pressure and high cholesterol will drop, oh and if you have type 2 diabetes it will improve if not cure you from it.Theres many ways to loose weight, but this is the final cure for obesity period, this is my opinion, a year and a half later and still havent gained any weight! check out some videos on youtube of ppl who have done it, some ppl post day by day and you can see their results.

  10. #30
    fttfbass is offline Senior Member
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    I really don't like the idea of a 500 calorie a day diet. But I have to admit, my friends wife does look good after being on this diet for such a short time. She didn't look "well" while she was on it, but now that she's off of it she looks healthy again.
    Luke-ISSA CFT & IKFF CKT

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