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VO2Max with swings

forth

New member
VO2Max training is all about heart rate, so yes you can get the same benefits. You can also get it from running or jump ropes if you prefer.

Just make sure you hit the heart rates needed.
 

Kenneth Jay

New member
VO2Max training is all about heart rate, so yes you can get the same benefits. You can also get it from running or jump ropes if you prefer.

Just make sure you hit the heart rates needed.

Well, it cant be done when measured in the lab.... which makes sense as there is a lot of static contractions going on the upper body which limits VO2 uptake and the upper body is needed for VO2 max with the kb since the contraction relaxation cycle for the lower body is significantly different compared to running or cycling....

the swing is way overrated for VO2max work- you can do it of course but if you can do something better why don't you?

download my latest study by clicking the link in my signature... that shows that a 1:2 / 1:1 ratio of intervals swings did not increase VO2max significantly compared to controls... over the course of 8 weeks... so for the moderately fit person it is not the best choice....
 

forth

New member
That's quite interesting. I would have imagined hitting the same high intensity would give you the same benefits regardless.. just it would be a lot harder to hit that level using swings.
 

mitak

New member
Well as Kenneth said there is a lot of static contraction going on the upper body so the muscles are not getting a lot of the oxygen from the blood. And the difference between arterial and venous oxygen levels is a part of the VO2 equation.
 
R

rifstonian

Guest
Actually, Kenneth has told me that the swing is between 80 and 90% as effective as the snatch at eliciting the changes in one's max Vo2. The "float" phase of the snatch is very important for unloading the tension that is necessary to elicit these changes ( afterload). The swing actually has TOO much muscular tension to create this effect although even 80% benefits is incredible.
 

Kenneth Jay

New member
well, in most recent research this could not be showed however... the way the swing is executed + baseline conditioning level + duration are factors that affect if the swing will work.... if a person is poorly conditioned then an 80% of what the snatch does (which is as close as 96% that of running) we end up with an intensity of around 77% of "true" VO2max provided that the swing is done more rhythmical in the contraction/relaxation cycle... this means that the forceful contraction has to be diminished as it will cut off blood flow for too big a part of the entire work...basically this means that the swing has to be done soft with only as much force as needed to get the kb to the desired height- nothing more... efficiency becomes a major part...
more likely is that if choosing the swing you will have to do much longer sets resembling long slow distance work....

/KJ
 

PeterHuntRKC

New member
That's quite interesting. I would have imagined hitting the same high intensity would give you the same benefits regardless.. just it would be a lot harder to hit that level using swings.

Hello, forth:

And you just heard it from the



Regards,
Peter.
 

forth

New member
well, in most recent research this could not be showed however... the way the swing is executed + baseline conditioning level + duration are factors that affect if the swing will work.... if a person is poorly conditioned then an 80% of what the snatch does (which is as close as 96% that of running) we end up with an intensity of around 77% of "true" VO2max provided that the swing is done more rhythmical in the contraction/relaxation cycle... this means that the forceful contraction has to be diminished as it will cut off blood flow for too big a part of the entire work...basically this means that the swing has to be done soft with only as much force as needed to get the kb to the desired height- nothing more... efficiency becomes a major part...
more likely is that if choosing the swing you will have to do much longer sets resembling long slow distance work....

/KJ

A very nice read. Will give me something for my mind to go over while I'm doing VS pressing today.

I get the impression now that the lockout is actually, for the "conditioning" effects, a quite important part of the snatch - and merely getting the bell somewhere overhead (a bit more than high-pull pretty much) would also get you stuck in the same boat as the swing. Refering to a video that popped up on this forum some days ago specifically.
 

forth

New member
Hello, forth:

This will help to explain the picture of the horse's mouth (new window).

(By the way, a punter is a gambler.)

Regards,
Peter.

Thanks a bunch. What a cool site that was too!

I thought it was all in the book...

Atleast for me this thread, Kenneths posts especially, have provided me with some deepend insights into things and some information that most definitely was not in the book. Also Peter provided me with a nice site where I can deepen my english skills (which I am aware are sadly lacking).

All in all I got good stuff out of this thread, most importantly my misunderstanding got cleared up... Did you get anything out if it other than an increased post count?
 

faizalenu

New member
Thanks a bunch. What a cool site that was too!



Atleast for me this thread, Kenneths posts especially, have provided me with some deepend insights into things and some information that most definitely was not in the book. Also Peter provided me with a nice site where I can deepen my english skills (which I am aware are sadly lacking).

All in all I got good stuff out of this thread, most importantly my misunderstanding got cleared up... Did you get anything out if it other than an increased post count?

Well, you have talked about the book. IF you had gotten the book, I think if anything that you should have gotten out of it, is WHY the snatch was chosen as the exercise and it is NOT just about getting the heart rate up.

Also, you're English is just fine.
 

forth

New member
Well, you have talked about the book. IF you had gotten the book, I think if anything that you should have gotten out of it, is WHY the snatch was chosen as the exercise and it is NOT just about getting the heart rate up.

Also, you're English is just fine.

Please provide a page number where it explains why the swing is absolutely no option, also preferably with the extra good information seen in this thread.

Why thank you. I'm not of the same opinion about my english skills, but that doesn't really matter.
 

forth

New member
While we're on the topic of VWC now all of a sudden... does anyone have a good idea about how to apply the protocols for running? I can't even figure out how to replace the cadence test!
 

faizalenu

New member
While we're on the topic of VWC now all of a sudden... does anyone have a good idea about how to apply the protocols for running? I can't even figure out how to replace the cadence test!

I believe there was a protocol posted previously, but personally I feel that the pounding the feet take in running and jumping would make them bad for MaxVO2. I think the bike would be a better choice.
 

forth

New member
I believe there was a protocol posted previously, but personally I feel that the pounding the feet take in running and jumping would make them bad for MaxVO2. I think the bike would be a better choice.

Oh ok. Too bad that the search function here seems borked.

I'm not sure about this pounding thing. I was under the impression that running was inherently good and it was a quite natural thing to do.. with good running technique of course.

Hitting 35 sets of 36:36 on feet sure seems more fun than snatching or biking. I guess I just like moving about.

It'd be very interesting to see all the protocols from VWC adapted for running. To me atleast.
 
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